Hey guys,
after reading up on selfhosting for weeks now I finally decided to take the plunge today and tried setting up my own nextcloud & jellyfin instances. For this purpose I am using a mini PC. (similiar to an Intel NUC)
Now I would like to make both services available to the internet so I could show images to friends while I’m at their place / watch movies with them.
The problem is I am currently not very educated on which security measures I would have to take to ensure that my server / mini PC doesn’t immediately become an easy target for a hacker, especially considering that I would host private photos on the nextcloud.
After googling around I feel like I find a lot of conflicting information as well as write-ups that I don’t fully grasp with my limited knowledge so if you guys have any general advice or even places to learn about all these concepts I would be absolutely delighted!
Thank you guys sooo much in advance for any and all help, the c/selfhosted community has been nothing but a great resource for me so far!!!
deleted by creator
I agree with this assessment. You do not need an overlay mesh network like tailscale for your use case that is way overkill.
And if you are running Jellyfin as opposed to Plex then you probably care about realizing the security benefits of open source so you definately don’t need a closed source proprietary solution like tailscale or creating accounts on someone elses computer for protection from x. Cloudflair is selling a closed source solution to a problem you don’t have.
This is selfhosting yet these recommendations are all for signing up for accounts and software from the largest centralized systems on the Internet and routing all your traffic through Oracle or cloudflair, lol If your going to do that then why not just host everything with Amazon or switch to Google products. You don’t need any of that noise.
Your best bet is to create a reverse proxy- a single ingress point in front of those few services with a single open port. Pick whatever web server you want your server already has Apache and it like 10 lines of config very simple.
Cloudflare is nice if your ISP uses CGNAT or blocks incoming port traffic (e.g. Starlink or T-Mobile 5G Home Internet).
I see. That‘s a valid use case. Although, in the spirit of self-hosting, I personally would either get another ISP or run a reverse proxy on a cheap VPS and connect the homeserver to that via Wireguard.
Yep. I actually do both. Wireguard on Oracle Cloud for my Plex.
Cloudflare to serve up stuff like Overseerr & my WordPress blog.
You can use
tailscalefor that too, but not raw wireguard.I actually do use raw Wireguard on an Oracle VCN instance so I can share my Plex on T-Mobile Home Internet.
(Plex is against Cloudflare’s ToS, which is why I don’t use them for Plex)
Tailscale is good for people who are techy enough to use it. But it’s not much help for my grandma if she wants to watch a Plex movie on her Roku.
Two remarks:
- Containers are (and never were) no security instruments but only fancy ways of bundling things
- You can open up other ports to the internet if you know what you’re doing. My SSH is open to the internet, but only with key based auto, and in case i need pw auth as a backup, only with 2FA enabled
So, putting a process in its own network, file-system, user etc. namespace does not increase security in your opinion?
Indeed. Sure, they have these features, but only if used correctly while introducing vast more complexity (especially when being executed in a k8s environment,but also executed in plain docker). But, you know what also has security when used correctly? Plain linux.
What about 90% of all images on docker hub executing their main payload as root? What about many images bundling unnecessary software like an init system? What about the fact that even if you rm something in a dockerfile, it is still present, if you execute the rm in a different RUN command? What about every user in the docker group being implicit root on the host since they simply can mount the host’s / inside their container? What about the reusing of layers between images like it is even intended?
Doesnt sound like a security tool, does it? Sure, it feels a bit like one, but it was never intended to be one, but a dependency and environment bundling tool which happens to use certain linux APIs which can be used for security. But it wraps lots of abstraction around it.
If you want to use these features for security, access them manually. But, OP said they are kind of a noob. Telling them to just use containers is dangerous and leads to false assumptions.
Source: i work as a cloud/container/devops/k8s expert for over 5 years.
If you want to use these features for security, access them manually. But, OP said they are kind of a noob. Telling them to just use containers is dangerous and leads to false assumptions.
You are absolutely correct. I should have stated explicitly that I didn’t mean docker and/or using pre-built container images. I was talking about something like systemd-nspawn. And you are right that I should not have brought this up in this context. I will edit my original comment.
Great, I accidentally deleted my original comment because the Lemmy web interface doesn’t ask for confirmation when you click the delete button. And the buttons are so small on mobile that it‘s really easy to click the wrong button.
I am using Tailscale.
In the spirit of selfhosting, you can also host headscale. Its an open source implementation of the proprietary tailscale control plane.
It allows you to get over the
5device limit (different depending on tiers), as well as keep your traffic on your devices. And, imo, it is pretty stable.The only issue is that the control plane (by nature) has to be publically accessible. But imo it’s way less of a security target than a massive app like nextcloud.
Edit: device limits were wrong
It allows you to get over the 5 device limit, as well as keep your traffic on your devices. And, imo, it is pretty stable.
I believe
tailscaleraised the device limit relatively recently but I agree with you in that I prefer to self-host this type of thing.AFAIK it’s now 100, so basically unlimited for personal use.
Not sure why the downvote, its right there on the website https://tailscale.com/pricing/
Thanks for the correction, edited the post.
Another vote for Tailscale. Relatively easy to set up and can has some pretty cool features I’m still learning about. I also share my Jellyfin server with family and friends and it meets expectations.
so in order for your friends and family to access your jellyfin server they have to first install and configure the tailscsle client on their devices then install and configure jellyfin?
Yea basically so I send an invite link for my Jellyfin server. They sign up and install the app then use the Tailscale IP to connect to the Jellyfin server. Usually pretty easy but if they don’t really understand I can do it for them once and then it’s good to go.
I went for wireguard VPN instead of exposing services. Its much more safe afaik, but you have to configure each device you want to give access (aka scanning QR code). You also dont need to buy a domain for that. Exposed services would be easier to use, especially if you want to use it on many devices
As soon as you put something up online, you will de facto become a target with nowhere to hide except offline. Your IP will be known and constantly hammered by more or less serious threats.
If you don’t know the basics of Linux system administration and typical security measures, I would propose 2 approaches: you can go “the NAS way” and purchase something turnkey like a Synology (or anything on which you can easily spin up containers to host your services). You can expect a large part of the administration to be taken care of with sound default settings.
Another approach is to use a beginner friendly distro like https://yunohost.org/ , perhaps more involving, more risky, bit more rewarding.
Also, don’t put anything up there like personal or valuable information (except if encrypted with local-only keys), expect to be hacked, expect to be wiped, and think early on about (off-site) backups.
Yup, if you have SSH service open on port 22, you’re automatically spammed by bots trying to brute force their way onto the system.
They’ll brute force ssh against any port, tbf, changing 22 to something else will not buy you much :)
Duckdns.org for dynamic dns. You can get a domain name like example.duckdns.org for free.
Caddyserver.com to reverse proxy to your running docker services. You’ll be able to set up jellyfin.example.duckdns.org
Crowdsec.net to secure the network
Tailscale for access to running docker services that you don’t need to share with friends.
Could you please be more specific what exactly Crowdsec brings to the table? In which way does it “secure the network”?
Crowdsec will analyse the logs from your reverse proxy and identify malicious actors, bots and whatever else you configure it to. It then tells a “bouncer” (part of your reverse proxy) to reject the request, block the IP or redirect them to a captcha.
The downside is that it’s kinda a pain to get set up, at least in my experience. It also stopped working without informing me and I’ve never been able to get it working again since. If you don’t use docker the experience might be a bit easier.
There’s even a Traefik Plugins for crowdsec. I guess it’s time to play with my Traefik Config again
DuckDNS is great, but you only need it if you have a dynamic IP. It’s worth checking if you have a static public IP before adding another layer of complexity.
If you are just exposing port 80 and 443 (standard web ports) cloudflare proxy is free and will work well to hide your IP.
Get yourself a domain name then use Cloudflare DNS to set an A record pointing to your home IP. If you have a dynamic IP (one that occasionally changes) you’ll want to read this: https://developers.cloudflare.com/dns/manage-dns-records/how-to/managing-dynamic-ip-addresses/
i have a lot of stuff exposed to the web. i got a domain from godaddy, attached my public ip and created a subdomain for each service. than i have traefik that manage the tls and route each subdomain to each of the docker containers.
in total i have exposed 80, 443, and a random port i use for ssh. of course ssh is only by public key.
now i’m trying to set up fail2ban on the exposed services since someone could bruteforce them.
That sounds pretty cool. So far, I have everything running behind vpn but a more integrated solution would totally make sense. A lot of apps have their own brute force throttling (such as nextcloud) btw.
i’ve added my server config as edit so you can go check it out.
i heve owncloud instead of nextcloud.
I‘m really sorry. I don’t see your edit. Checked all your comments as well. Maybe I‘m overlooking it.
here it is: https://github.com/simone-viozzi/my-server
Thats quite an elaborate list you have there! Thanks for sharing! I‘d need to heavily sanitize and structure my log to be able to put it on github. Good job! :)
The other day I learned about endlessh. I set that up, switched my actual sshd to listen on a different port, and the ssh login attempts from randoms essentially went down to 0. Pretty neat.
Sounds like security by obscurity to me. But still, nice result.
It’s more targeted to avoid automated attacks.
Nah, as long as you keep following recommended security practices it can be useful to get rid of unneeded load being put on your server by malicious bots.
I had a lot of problems with botnets hammering my SSH service on my private VPS. Moving it to a different port would only work for a few days before they’d be back at it again.I wasn’t worried they’d get in. But logging in to my server would take ages because it was under so much load (VPS is pretty low-spec). Finally decided to shove my SSH service behind port knocking. Got rid of all the bots knocking at my door.
Obscurity has its uses, as long as you don’t consider it a replacement for security. It’s just an additional tool.
Cool! I’m using fail2ban for cloud VMs, seems to keep the log chatter down
Best advice I can give is to make sure the default virtualhost on nginx/apache just sends a 404 to all requests to your IP, and only serve the apps you want when they’re accessed by the correct hostname. The vast majority of spammy scanners are just hitting all public IPs, so as long as you don’t tell them what you’re hosting you’ll be alright.
Then, I’d advise having some sort of basic web application firewall (WAF). Modsecurity is a common one, NAXSI is another. These take some time to set up, but are quite good at absorbing attempted attacks.
I serve HTTP 403 for all requests to the default vhost and log them, harvest IPs through a log aggregator (or just fail2ban) and tag them as bad bots/scanners, and eternal-ban them on all my hosts. Currently have 98451 addresses or networks in my ipset for these.
For requests to actual domains, I ban after a few unsuccessful authentication attempts. A WAF is nice to have (tedious but fun to set up) - currently working on improving my Modsecurity setup.
Other than that there is already good advice here:
- keep OS/packages/installed services up-to-date
- only run software from trusted (ideally signed) sources
- use host and network-based firewalls
- use strong encryption and authentication everywhere
- only expose what is absolutely required
- implement good privilege separation (even dedicated users for each app/service, proper file ownership/permissions goes a long way)
- run scanners to detect possible misconfigurations/hardening measures (
systemd-analyze securitywas mentioned, I also likelynisanddebsecan) - set up proper logging/monitoring alerting
Yep, banning scanners with
ipsetlists is a great solution. I use a slightly convoluted method to perma-ban abusers, but fail2ban also works great.
My approach was to set it all up internally, create a wireguard VPN accesspoint and only open that up. That way I don’t have as much to worry as much within the network (still use generated passwords for things) and able to access it anywhere.
Granted, you asked about opening up to the www. I’d suggest buying a domain through cloudfront, setting up an nginx instance that proxies traffic (think nextcloud.mydomain.com), and have it only accept connections from cloudfront servers.
That allows you SSL termination, pretty good bot coverage, and a nice domain name to share as needed.
General advice would be to look boring and hide your IP as much as you are able (get a domain). As long as you’re not looking juicy you won’t attract skilled attention. It’s like locking a bike, most bad actors will just pass by looking around for one without a lock or a real fancy one worth their resources.
You can utilize Cloudflare’s free offerings, starting with simple stuff. Their DNS Proxy is essentialy a single-click but will help substantially. You can build on top of that with simple WAF rules, such as droping connection attempts from IPs originating from countries notorious for “poking around”. You can also reverse that rule and whitlelist only your country.
Keep your firewall tight, don’t expose other ports, put your services behind a reverse proxy and redirect everything to HTTPS. Start simple, constantly improve, learn more advanced methods/concepts.
How is getting a domain protecting you IP? Wouldn’t your IP still be accessible even after you link it to a domain?
Yes, but by proxying your traffic via cloudflare your domain will point to their IP instead of yours directly.
So it makes you IP less discoverable. However, if someone finds your IP randomly (through brute force), would you still be vulnerable? Or is it possible to only port forward to a static CF address so only CF can connect to you outside of your home network?
You would, but that’s where your firewall and SSL certificates come into play. I use a reverse proxy and forward port 80/443 directly to it. Everything I host resolves to a CNAME in Cloudflare and my proxy responds with a 404 to any unknown requests.
You’d set your firewall rules to only accept requests from the cloudflare datacenter IPs for those port forwards. So, the ports would be otherwise blocked to anyone else trying to access them directly.
My bad, I should have worded that better, thank you for making it clear, that’s exactly what I had in mind.
It comes down to using secure passwords, 2 factor authentication, and updating software as soon as you can.
Check out Cloudflare’s zero tier tunnel to only expose the services you need without port forwarding. Added benefit of masking your home’s IP behind Cloudflare to prevent DDOS. Only downside is you need your own domain.
Why would anyone DDOS a random home server? I don‘t think OP has to worry about that.
Depends on the hardware, but my weak server can sometimes be overwhelmed with random ip trying to find a vulnerable service (accessing random port and path combination)
deleted by creator
The multifactor can’t be understated as part of your security stance! I turn it on and enforce it on my home network for any service I host that supports it. And like mentioned elsewhere, only 80 and 443 are opened and they go straight through a proxy.
Just make sure you know how to properly secure your network, check logs, ensure you have logs. ensure you have backups in a secure location…
And, be prepared for the constant barrage of vulnerability scans, and login attempts.
I think you can go with Yunohost. It is easy to start selfhosting and exposing services to the web. I use it for more than a year, and it is super cool. Especially I love the fact, that it is easy for newcomers, but also it is opened for customisation for more pro users. Yunohost provides domain with ddns, Fail2Ban and tells which ports should be opened (80 and 443 is all you need, maybe another one for ssh). It also provides SSO for hiding services that do not use authentication.
